# I bet we haven't heard the last of this !



## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

http://www.grandviewoutdoors.com/predator-hunting/articlecontent/5/2012/3640/court-affirms-illegal-immigrants-cant-have-guns


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## loic (May 8, 2012)

What part of Illegal immigrant that guy didn't understand? He should have been deported

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## 220swift (Mar 2, 2011)

Some bleeding heart attorney is now going to take this on....

"constitutional definitions of "people'' as opposed to "citizens'' could end up before the U.S. Supreme Court."

Wait until the main stream left antis jump on this it will get more attention than our failing economy.


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## hassell (Feb 9, 2010)

The problem with our society from our two countries is that so many people can't understand the word illegal, go to any country in the world where any of these people have come from and go make demands and see how fast you'll get shipped home, HA !!!


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## 220swift (Mar 2, 2011)

You are absolutely correct about that hassell......


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## Rick Howard (Feb 25, 2012)

As unpopular as it may be... Technically the guy is correct that illegal aliens are in fact protected by the US constitution. He just missed the fine print that is the GCA 1968.

You can count on him being removed. They will send him packing for sure. They try very hard to send people back. I know that is contrary to popular belief. The government looks for any reason they can to deny entry or "deport" someone. The new technical term is Removal. Technically deport died with INS.


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## prairiewolf (Feb 19, 2012)

The problem with our society from our two countries is that so many people can't understand the word illegal, go to any country in the world where any of these people have come from and go make demands and see how fast you'll get shipped home, HA !!!

I agree !!!!


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## prairiewolf (Feb 19, 2012)

hassell said:


> The problem with our society from our two countries is that so many people can't understand the word illegal, go to any country in the world where any of these people have come from and go make demands and see how fast you'll get shipped home, HA !!!


I agree !!!


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## ReidRH (Feb 1, 2010)

_*I Get Pretty Irate at the fact These Illegals can come over here and Demand Anything! I know they are looking for a better Life Great I am all for that! DO IT LEGALLY and I really do not have a Problem with it. My Great Grand Parents came from Ireland They did it Legally and Guess What My Whole family is Still here! Not Split up by Some Legal Mumbo Jumbo Crap! Awww See there YALL went and Got me Started again!!*_


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## bones44 (Jan 7, 2011)

I don't see the anti's picking up on this one because then it can be thrown back in their face that they support gun ownership. I'm totally against anyone who doesn't have the decency to fill out the proper paperwork and work hard to get their citizenship. These guys who work for cash and pay zero taxes while having their families get medical care in our hospitals should be buried under the jail, not sent back. They'll find a way to get back here and do it all over again. When I was in the service you better dam well believe we had to follow customs and laws in other countries we were in or you in head deep in $%%^^. After they were done with you our gov't. got their turn with you. Goes both ways !


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## wilded (Feb 10, 2010)

Get caught with an undocumented firearm in mexico and they will lock you up and throw the key away if they do not put you up against the nearest adobe wall and shoot you.


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

That is absolutely true Ed. A few years ago a man was caught at the border with a single box of ammo. He was thrown in jail. It cost his family thousands of dollars before our goobermint stepped up and secured his release.


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## JTKillough (May 4, 2010)

OK, heres my take on this situation. It's our own fault! Fact is, our government (elected by us) fails and refuses to do anything to stop folks from coming across our borders. Worst yet, often times the only folks getting deported are the poor and pennyless that flock to us for a better life. Those that are here to break laws and endanger citizens are either left alone or overlooked. I can't blame a guy for trying to provide a better life for his family. Put in that situation, all of us would probably do the same and try to slip across the border. What we need is a system where we could check these folks out and SELECT those that can be upstanding citizens and deserve to be allowed into our country. Then close down the gaps that allow undesirables in. Time to VOTE!


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## Rick Howard (Feb 25, 2012)

Okay I will give.... I am sure this won't make me popular. My wife is an Immigration Lawyer..... I know I know.... My stock went down 2 cents but it was only worth 4 to start with. She deals with these issues on a daily basis. She spends half of her time helping Canadians that were denied entry. Most of them did something stupid when they were a kid and now, 20 years later, are turned away at the border. But the other half is a wild tangled mess of other not so common issues.

There is much much much more to this topic than I am about to go into. I just want to point out a few things quick. As I agree the system has it flaws. However they are not as simple as some media may portray them.

There are too many generalizations in regards to this subject. There are a lot of reasons someone could be here illegally. However they are all counted the same. I will detail a few common issues.

Probably the most common these days:
Depending on where you are from, it can be easy to come here legally. Other places it is not so simple. Obviously the first people that come to mind are Mexicans. They are the largest population of immigrants now. The folks down south might have to wait 10 years before you can come here legal to work. That is an unreasonable time frame for someone trying to support a family. So they sneak across. Most of the ones that get caught are good people. That is because most good people try to do the right thing.... which often times gets you caught. Folks who are up to no good are usually better at avoiding authorities. I guess that just comes with being a scoundrel. The scoundrels are the ones that stereotype the rest. This is the natural progression of many immigrants. Most some here with good intentions and some with bad. Look back in history. Italians are probably the most notable. There were millions that came here. Who got noticed? The Maffia! Yupp they were a problem. But all of Italians.... Half of the Italians.... Nope... about 1%. But even to this day it stays with them. Just like if you are from Ireland you must be drunk and love potatoes. Yes back in the day most of them came here legally. Back then the rules were, if you got off the boat and did not have lice... you are in.

I bet this is a surprise:
Some folks are here illegally but not by choice. They were legal when they came here but as the laws change with each administration, the rules might change on them. Oops! I am here illegally?

This is where JT really nailed it:
A lot of people who are removed (deported) were here legally but committed a crime a long time ago and have since lived an honest tax paying life here. Then the government decides to remove them years after the fact.

Okay I know this is a hot issue. I really debated if I should write it or not. I felt compelled to though. I don't want to start an argument. I am not telling anyone they are wrong. I also want to say that I am not a bleeding heart. Well it is filled with blood, but not sympathy for folks that want to do wrong. I just wanted to point out that this issue goes deeper than most would think and is skewed by many things. My wife is not an overly sympathetic person either. Just a realist who knows the system is bad and needs to be changed. Unfortunately this is a political issue and like most things politics screw it up.

Please don't hate me


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## loic (May 8, 2012)

I am a foreign citizen, I came in the US in 1994 with a E2 visa, then after many years I had an H1B visa, I have a clean record , and extremely qualified in my field. It took me 17 years to get my green card and thousands of dollars.
So, as much as I understand why people would want to come illegally I just can't understandstand it period. You are illegal you are out.

USCIS is nothing but a business.

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## bones44 (Jan 7, 2011)

Loic congratulations on the long road you had to take to get here. It's sad that money is even part of becoming a citizen in the land of the "free".


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## loic (May 8, 2012)

bones44 said:


> Loic congratulations on the long road you had to take to get here. It's sad that money is even part of becoming a citizen in the land of the "free".


Thank you, it was a big weight over my head that was removed. Immigration agent can deny you entry at anytime, my family and I got stuck for several hours in New York airport several years ago when we were coming back from vacation, we missed our connection of course and somebody took our luggage.... Even if you are legal ....and that's bull...

I have to wait 4 more years, but then I will apply for citizenship. At that time I will be here for 22 years..

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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

Loic, Congrats on earning your status. I too believe the laws are flawed, however they are the laws.


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## prairiewolf (Feb 19, 2012)

itz, I agree the system for immigrants needs to be fixed but where I disagree with you is on the percentage that misuse the system. You may be right in NY but here in Az I would put it 80-90 % of them learn or already know how to misuse the system. Yes alot of them come for work, but the big deal is they will use different last names for work and then still go get on the system. They know how to use the system and have known for a long time, now the younger generation as seen this and have started using the system. My 2 sons use to ask my wife and myself, Why cant we have a new car like Julio"s family or Do I get a new car when I get 16 like Jesse did? But you are right there is alot more to it than gets told and that goes both ways I guess. I"ve lived with it my whole life here in Az (since I was 8) and it is bringing this country down. My step dad use to bring workers to the fields with green cards back in the 60"s and they were really here just for work and didnt get on the system.So I have seen how it has changed and its only getting worse. I really think most come for our free handouts along with some work.


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

Ed is right. Ask a hospital worker how many babies are born to illegals here. They come here just to give birth, then the child is a citizen. Do you think they pay the hospital bill ? Several hospitals in southern California have gone out of business as a direct result of this type of abuse....What do you do ? You can't deny a woman ready to drop a baby medical care..you can't force them to pay the bill. I'm in favor of changing the amendment to our constitution giving automatic citizenship to any one born here.


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## prairiewolf (Feb 19, 2012)

+1 Don !!!


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

Thanks Ed.

Back on topic though

The reasoning behind the original rule in the 1968 Gun control act is fairly obvious.


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## Rick Howard (Feb 25, 2012)

I regret my last posting. I am sorry if I offended anyone. My intent was to add to the conversation. Due to my unique situation, I thought I was adding information pertaining to the subject that some folks might not know. As I said I don't want anyone to think I was disagreeing with their comments. Quite the opposite. I agree.

Sorry Don. I know you asked us to get back on topic. I felt compelled to clear the air. After rereading my post I wanted to make sure everyone understood that I am not downplaying the issues that you folks face out west.


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## Hellbilly1373 (May 12, 2012)

I happen to live in a place where the state government assigned as a refugee town, each year over 300 people are imported, given a place to live, a drivers license, free rent and food. Very few ever learn to speak english or get jobs, yet they have produced enough children so that in my daughters high school there are 27 different languages spoken. Its been over 15 years since this program started and to say the least, it has got out of hand. The crime is now to the point that there are places that you can't go at night or you will be jumped, you can't park your car certain places or it will be broken into or stolen. I am at the point where I will soon be moving from where I was born and raised, because this once small quiet town has become a littered, graffitied, loud, stinking cess pool, where rape, murder, and arson are in the news daily. We once had 20 cops in this town, now there are 180 and the city wants to hire more. Ill be glad to leave this place behind, but how long will it be till it all happens again somewhere else?


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## ReidRH (Feb 1, 2010)

youngdon said:


> Ed is right. Ask a hospital worker how many babies are born to illegals here. They come here just to give birth, then the child is a citizen. Do you think they pay the hospital bill ? Several hospitals in southern California have gone out of business as a direct result of this type of abuse....What do you do ? You can't deny a woman ready to drop a baby medical care..you can't force them to pay the bill. I'm in favor of changing the amendment to our constitution giving automatic citizenship to any one born here.


Well Change the Law if the Mother is Illegal then the Child is NOT a Citizen! That Alone would Stop a Whole Lot of the Anchor Babies we hear so much about.

It is a Shame that it takes So much Money and So Many Years to Get to Where You Can apply to become a Citizen But Right now That is the Law. But it should make American Citizenship all the more Precious Once Achieved. I am Sure it is a Struggle to Become A US Citizen, But if it were not worth the Struggle there would be Noone Trying to achieve Citizenship.

IOIC I am Glad for you that You have come as far as you have toward Obtaining Citizenship Stick With it, I will Celebrate with you when You do Become a Citizen. Thank You For Doing it The Right Way!

ItzDirty, Your Comments Are appreciated too. That is What is so good about this Site We Can have an Adult Discussion about Diverse Subjects And Still Remain "Friends" without all the Drama and Stupidity of a lot of other Sites! I am Sure You could give us Plenty of Horror Stories about legal Immigration and my Heart goes out to the people Stuggling to get here and get their Citizenship Legally! My Great Grand Parents on Both Sides Were Immigrants I am Blessed they went through What ever it was that they did to obtain theirs so I would have a better life than they did!


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## Rick Howard (Feb 25, 2012)

ReidRH said:


> I am Sure You could give us Plenty of Horror Stories about legal Immigration and my Heart goes out to the people Stuggling to get here and get their Citizenship Legally!


Thank you. Your one sentence summed up my points exactly. My experiences are with the folks who are trying to do it the right way. They get a bum rep because of the ones who don't.


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## hassell (Feb 9, 2010)

Well we could go on forever on this topic, everyone made valid points and gave some good examples, was always a thorn in my side over the many years that our Gov. handled and screwed up the illegals problems, our country was the leader of all nations as the premiere place to come to, the benefits were incredible and all the other perks that came with entrance, admittance numbers have slowed down but money still buys you're way in as usual!!!


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## eyemall (Jul 5, 2010)

Even if they were born here to illegal parents then they shouldnt be allowed to purchase guns or to get any kind of governmental help. Free healthcare and free education shouldnt be allowed. The only thing free they should get is a free trip back to where they came from....


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## ReidRH (Feb 1, 2010)

_*All the Laws in the World arent worth anything if they are not being enforced! Lawlessness Breeds Chaos! Many of the People coming in from Mexico are good hard working People! But Many of them are Gangstas and Crooks, I know we could talk for years on this subject and even Now In Congress they are talking of giving Illegals a VOTE and One Illegal in Florida has Petitioned to become a Lawyer for Goodness Sakes, Where do you draw a line, I Say if they are illegals they need to be Shipped home! Do it the Legal Way or Stay Out!! JMO*_


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## JTKillough (May 4, 2010)

ReidRH said:


> _*All the Laws in the World arent worth anything if they are not being enforced! Lawlessness Breeds Chaos! Many of the People coming in from Mexico are good hard working People! But Many of them are Gangstas and Crooks, I know we could talk for years on this subject and even Now In Congress they are talking of giving Illegals a VOTE and One Illegal in Florida has Petitioned to become a Lawyer for Goodness Sakes, Where do you draw a line, I Say if they are illegals they need to be Shipped home! Do it the Legal Way or Stay Out!! JMO*_


Exactly! Well said!


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## Antlerz22 (Apr 18, 2011)

youngdon said:


> Ed is right. Ask a hospital worker how many babies are born to illegals here. They come here just to give birth, then the child is a citizen. Do you think they pay the hospital bill ? Several hospitals in southern California have gone out of business as a direct result of this type of abuse....What do you do ? You can't deny a woman ready to drop a baby medical care..you can't force them to pay the bill. I'm in favor of changing the amendment to our constitution giving automatic citizenship to any one born here.


 If they were born here from illegal aliens then they (baby) should have the same status as what borne them--the other side of the coin as an example would be two LEGAL american parents birthing and their child be labeled illegal--now that wouldnt be right so the latter should also be held accordingly. Cant have it both ways! Lastly whatever country they come from IF they try legally to enter then the same should be done, reciprocity I say unless their laws are too lax OR are changed to undermine what we impose on their citizens.


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

Changing things to make the baby illegal will actually take an amendment to the constitution, and given the number of hispanics that vote itis highly unlikely that Congress will act.


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