# Where Freedom Reigns



## glenway (Mar 27, 2011)

Funny thing, as we were driving along a route where a traffic cop was directing traffic to an event called Country Thunder. He took a look at us two varmints dressed in full camo in Eric's Jeep and saluted us as we passed by.

The Second Amendment lives in Arizona: http://www.ammoland.com/2014/04/michigans-cold-vs-arizonas-warm-freedom/#axzz2znU1Ze3E


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## hassell (Feb 9, 2010)

As usual great writeup Glen, as it should be.


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

A good read Glen.


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## sneakygroundbuzzard (Nov 1, 2012)

great write up indeed

so if i read that correctly,there is no shade in arizona then 

here in mn we also have to have a permit to carry

the wife and i both have them

however ours are just that permit to carry

we can carry openly or concealed

if im not working i am always carrying my side arm

some times concealed,and other times open

sometimes i get looks when carrying open and other times i dont

i let the place im going dictate which way i carry

but i prefer open carry

the minnesota gun rights group is trying to get the law changed so that if your legal to purchase a hand gun your legal to carry it

as it is right now,once you pass a back ground check to purchase hand gun,you must still apply for a carry permit and pass another back ground check and go thru classes

i have no problem with the required classes

but having to apply again and go thru another background check just seems to be redundent to me


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## azpredatorhunter (Jul 24, 2012)

Here in Arizona we have an Alaska style carry law... you can carry in the open or concealed, no permit needed. " The way it should be in America"...


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

Yes, as long as you can legally to possess it, we still don't allow felons, illegals or mental defectives to carry.


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## azpredatorhunter (Jul 24, 2012)

Amen...


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## catcapper (Feb 11, 2010)

Hey Tim--- more applications equals more money--- its standard government think'in.lol.

Carry laws here in Colorado must have been made by those who inhale deeply.

Persons can open carry in the state except where your not permitted to open carry (some cities). Concealed carry is by permit only except where your not permitted to conceal carry (some cities/countys). But--- persons can conceal carry "without" a permit if they are hunt'in.

Puff, Puff.

awprint:


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

That is perfectly clear.....I'm sure that the towns that don't allow it have big signs saying so !


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## catcapper (Feb 11, 2010)

:roflmao:

awprint:


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## sneakygroundbuzzard (Nov 1, 2012)

catcapper said:


> Hey Tim--- more applications equals more money--- its standard government think'in.lol.
> 
> Carry laws here in Colorado must have been made by those who inhale deeply.
> 
> ...


ya i suppose yuor right on the fact its more moeny for the state

after all mn is like the third highest taxed state in the nation

they are always finding a reason to take more of my hard earned cash from me

i dont mind paying "fees" for hunting and the like because that money for the most part does go back into our local public lands and fisheries

but to charge me twice for the same freaken back ground check for the same handgun is just plain redundent

i sure hope the minnesota gun rights group does get the law changed

but i hope that they do require going to a class to carry so that you have to prove your proficency with a hand gun before you can carry

when the wife and i took our class a year or so back it was very informative on the laws etc

when we went to the range to take the proficency test i was dumb founded on how many people in the class had no idea on how to load and handle a hand gun safely or even how to properly hold and shoot one

we were required to shoot a minimum of 15 rds and keep them in center mass of a silhouette target at distances of 7 to 21 feet (the distances that most self protection needs are done at)

most folks there couldnt even hit the target at 21 feet let alone put it in center mass.some of these folks fired more than 100 rds before they met the requirements

proud to say the wife and i both did it in the minimum required 15 rds, for both of us all 15 rds were in center mass

the instructors looked at both of us and said "looks like you two have done this before"

we just smiled and said "yes we have"

they liked how we were both able to show them how to properly load/unload,hold,fire and safely handle a hand gun


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

Do you mean to say that just because I bought a handgun I'm not a perfect shot ... ?


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## sneakygroundbuzzard (Nov 1, 2012)

no Don thats not what im saying

im just saying that some folks try to get their carry permit just because they can legaly

even though they dont know how to handle or shoot one properly

which makes for some unsafe folks carrying them


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

I'm yanking you SGB that's exactly what needs to be said though, most handgun owners cant shoot worth a damn.


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## sneakygroundbuzzard (Nov 1, 2012)

Don, i know you were just yanking my chain

and your absolutely right

most folks that own a handgun cant shoot them worth crap,but yet they want to carry

this scares me

this is why i think a competency test is a good thing

i cant count the number of times i have been at a gun range and had folks,both young and old,shooting next to me that cant hit the target with hand gun at close distance.

most times its just simple fundementals that are keeping them from be proficient.

like their stance,the way the hold the fire arm etc.

when i see this,most times i also hear comments that they make about me and the wife. things like "wow they sure can shoot"(not trying to toot my own horn)

when i hear these i comments i ask them if i can give some advise,and 99.9% of the time they say "sure"

then i point out the proper stance and hold of a hand gun(whether it be pistol or semi auto) and the proper site alignment.

i then show them and then have them repeat what i just showed them, and wouldnt ya know it then they start to be hitting the paper.

and i tell them to just keep practing what i told and shwoed them and they will keep getting better.

i always get a big thank you and sometimes the ladies give me a hug too


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## dwtrees (Mar 5, 2012)

sometimes the ladies give me a hug too :smile:

Now we know the real reason, just for the hugs. lol


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

I agree totally with the proficiency test. That is one thing i never liked or understood about AZ's law. Some one can go buy a gun and carry. The test should be simple and FREE.


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## azpredatorhunter (Jul 24, 2012)

I disagree with the proficiency test. ie: if a little old man or lady who can't hit the broad side of a barn, can't pass the test, he or she cannot carry a pistol to protect themselves? Think about it. When your father handed you a shot gun ect. for the first time, were you proficent with it? Proficiency comes with time, not some test...ie: everyone takes a driving test and 1/2 can't drive worth a $hit. Arizona is the wild west and should stay that way! No one is forced to live here nor should anyone be forced to take a test. Most of the time, just the display of a firearm changes the mind of a criminal.


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## sneakygroundbuzzard (Nov 1, 2012)

az, i didnt grow up knowing my dad

however one of my grandfathers taught me to shoot

started off with the pellet rifle shooting pigeons in the barn,then moved to the .22 shooting at gophers in the field,then the 12 ga shooting clay pigeons

we werent allowed to go into the woods with him untill we could prove that we could properly handle a fire arm and shoot it proficiently

and oh what a treat it was when we finally made the grade and were asked to go out in the woods hunting with him

great days indeed

and would you really want to be around that little ol man or lady thst cant hit the braod side of a barn but is carrying a gun for protection,when they feel the need to use it. then they pull the trigger and send a stray round off into god knows what direction and its no where near the perp they are trying to stop.

any one at any age can be taught to properly handle and shoot a hand gun with the right coaching

i dont think they should have to pay for classes,but i think as responsible business owners the owners of shooiting ranges/gun clubs should offer thee classes for free.

i know it would costs them money for the instructers but in the long run alot of people will joint these clubs and ranges just to keep in practice. so they get their money back in the long run


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

:that:

No one handed me a gun and said, go walk around and try not to shoot someone. When Dad bought me my first gun (BB) there was a training period where I didn't touch the gun without his supervision, the same took place with my first shotgun, once you learned to shoot and handle it safely, you were allowed to use it, when others were around. The last thing I want is to be walking down the street and be hit by a stray bullet some idiot let fly.

So what happens to the guy who misses and hits someone else AZ ?


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## knapper (Feb 5, 2010)

I went ahead and got my carry permit even though I did not need it incase I am in another state that has receiproctiy with us and can carry then. At the shooting part the guy running the range was inpressed with my grouping. I was using my 357 mag. and when I carry it is a revolver. I have autos but like wheel guns to carry.


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