# Feral dogs?



## youngdon

Does anyone have advice on how to call in feral dogs? I met a rancher while I was out coyote hunting in March and gave him my phone number in case he needed any depredation work done. Well he called and he has a pack of feral dogs that are harassing his cattle. One has a broken leg now from being chased he thinks. He said that he would also take me up on my offer to take him out with me. Thanks in advance for your input.

Don


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## bar-d

Youngdon,
We have feral dogs around here and occasionally they are a problem. Being feral, I would think they would respond to distress calls just like any other predator. If they were domesticated at one time and then escaped or was dumped by their owners, it would wind up being a lot like the coydogs we have discussed here on PT. JMO


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## wilded

Baby calf, goat or lamb cries and bawls seem to trigger ferals into coming around here. It seems like they would rather take livestock than something harder to run down or catch. JMHO

Be sure and SSS
(shoot, shovel, shutup)


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## youngdon

The rancher who holds private lease to the land has given his permission and will accompany me on the first hunt at least, so I am not worried about digging. I know that some have a problem with what were once domestic animals and their demise but they are much more aggressive than any coyote I have ever seen, due to the fact that they don't have the fear of humans. I plan on changing that.


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## bar-d

A few years ago a fellow that lived across the road from one of my pastures had a fairly large dog that would chase my calves. When I would show up, he would skulk out of the pasture. One day a neighbor kid came and told me the dog was chasing my calves again. I jumped in the pickup and drove to the place and found the dog cowering in the corner of the pens right in the crosshairs of a not so friendly 400 lb. heifer. For some reason, this time he was glad to see me. I walked up and kicked the pens and he turned and bolted for home with the heifer in hot pursuit. He made it to his house across the road and promptly hid. I knocked on the door and told the people face to face that this had been going on for months and I was tired of them ignoring the problem. I told them "if I catch your dog on my place chasing my cattle again, I will kill him graveyard dead and leave him for the coyotes". Never saw the dog in my pasture again.


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## El Gato Loco

Keep us posted on what happens. This is an interesting topic and i'd like to follow along.


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## Cliffy

Domestic Dogs gone feral are as dangerous as Wild Wolves. CANINES include: Dogs, Wolves, and Coyotes, all of which can harass farmers, ranchers, and pet owners. City folk consider domestic dogs as PETS. Once run wild, these canines are no longer "man's-best-friend" creatures. What is so difficult about understanding the word FERAL? I'd have personal problems regarding leveling my scope crosshairs on a Golden Retreiver, yet once gone rogue these canines are vicious predators. "PET OWNERS" must control the beast within their "PETS." Keeping a pet dog under control is golden, and requires considerable training. If a dog jumps up upon it's owner, it is is not properly-trained. I can count upon one hand the dogs I know that I would consider well-trained. Cliffy


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## youngdon

I went out late this morning with the rancher (he had an early commitment) after a little scouting and just getting a feel for the property we made a few stands. I tried some rabbit distress first stand with no takers. The second stand was what I thought to be a good spot and it was but not for the feral dogs we were looking for we called two grey fox to about twelve feet. Rancher friend wanted to blast them and tan the hides. I told him no wait till fall as they are out of season. The second stand i used my old JS PMaster with the fawn bleating. We did see a spot that looks as though they had spent some time laying around at. There were tracks all over and a collar that looked to be chewed off from one of them. No ID on the collar though. I dropped a little jerky around to see if they come around between now and when I get back. I am going to try to make it back there early next week as the wife and I are going to the cabin this weekend!!


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## wilded

The problem is not the landowners or the law in most cases. It is the owner suing you for shooting their dog. It can literally cost you hundreds of thousands of dollars if you lose and thousands of dollars if you win. You must hire an attorney and fight the suit. You can win and still spend thirty thousand dollars in this day and time. Thus do as you must, but SSS. JMHO


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## Rile

We have killed dogs that have taken up the habit of killing livestock. I agree with everyone else. When they start that it is hard to break them and really no way to tell if they are totally broken. It's true you can land in hot water for killing someone's dog but not if you keep it to yourself. Most of my neighbors have livestock and it's sort of an unwritten rule that when you find one chasing livestock you just do it it in, IF it appears to be trying to bring the animal down. Sometimes it's just a stupid dog having fun. You should be sure before killing it or them.


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## youngdon

This ranch is located twelve miles from the nearest house (other than ranch owned) and the dogs are in a pack of approx. twenty. I doubt I'm gonna have to deal with a pet owner let alone an irresponsible one. I have not nor will I give the location of this property nor will I post pictures of it or anything that happens to run into one of my bullets. These dogs have already done a fair amount of damage to this mans herd and property. He is now a friend of mine and he needs help, nuff said, he'll get it from me for those reasons alone.


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## El Gato Loco

I've heard stories from the guys in southern Missouri who deal with feral dogs. Some talk about going out with at least 3 guys so that they can sit / stand shoulder to shoulder in a triangle for when the dogs come in. Apparently they like to run in packs and surround the call. They bring along at least 3 guys for safety alone.

Let us know how it turns out. Hopefully you can solve your friends problem.


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## eshunter86

That is most definitely true. If there moving in a pack of 20, you can bet there hunting and attacking the same way. The unfortunate part as was said earlier, once "mans best friend" gets that taste for blood he becomes "mans worste enemy" because there not afraid. These animals need to be dealt with quickly and swiftly, as well as there former owners for being lazy and stupid. If i could be there or even get out there you can believe that i would in a heart beat because this is an increasing problem everywhere. keep us posted on your friends problems. let us know if you need any help or guidance


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## IBGunner

Calling Feral Dogs: Really there are two kinds and like some posts said "feral" can have all kinds of meanings. True feral dogs are pretty rare but semi-domestic or out-of-control dogs can be a big problem. They will respond to distress calls but like coyotes they have to be in the area and when you are calling specific animals the difficulty and timing can become much more complex. Also, semi-domestic dogs can be very wary, especially if they have been shot at. There have been several times that I've been called on to deal with them. Baiting can be much more effective than calling and much less time consuming. A good bait pile and a long range rifle is an excellent way of dealing with them.... if you are CERTAIN it is the right dog... and that can be a problem as well. Your best bet... and the one that will keep you out of a jam... is to regularly patrol an area with a rifle and take down an animal that you catch in the act of raiding or doing damage.


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## Cliffy

I've never shot a feral dog, and I dare anyone to prove otherwise. Since I carry only a meager .243 Winchester with tiny 62 grain Barnes Varmint Grenade bullets, one should understand I primarily target Prairie Dogs. What harm to a 150 pound Rotweiler gone FERAL can a mere 62 grain bullet travelling less than 3850 fps cause? Barely a tick bite on its asset? Once Feral, a once, if perhaps, "good" dog has gone very bad, wrong, and extremely dangerous regarding livestock, pets, and human children. PLEASE control your Vicious Pet, and you know that it is if it is, or I might look at it as a potential killer of children. If it has teeth, it can bite. I know most gentle house pets harbor sharp, pointy teeth, and that's okay. I hope to never have to cull someone's "pet" no matter how nervy or dangerous it has become. cliffy


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## gonefishn

Three words can handle this situation: Shoot, Shovel and Shutup!


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## youngdon

Well I finally was able to match schedules with my rancher friend, and we had quite a morning. After a couple of dry sets we managed to call in two fox on the third (out of season) so no shooting yet. My friend suggested that we try a spot on a neighboring ranch that abuts his property not far from where we had seen alot of tracks. There is water and shade for them as the water hole is quite overgrown with a mesquite thicket that is about an acre in size. There was a steady wind from the west so we circled north to the east side and set up on a knoll over looking the water. From that high spot we could see the water and a clearing around it on the west and north. I had set the caller down on the north east corner about thirty yards from the edge of the thicket in a big cholla cactus. i had decided to give pup distress a try as several here had suggested (thanks). I had not even turned the volume up to where we could hear it and we spotted movement in the thicket, Javalina freekin' javalina there were fourteen of them that came out of that thicket like we had lit it on fire and they were running in our general direction although they did veer off at the bottom of the knoll into a wash. Holy crap that got the adrenaline going. No dogs, tracks by the water but no dogs. We did manage two more sets with no luck but found yet another area that looks as though they had spent some time there. We'll try again soon and I'll keep you posted.


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## 525fittertct

if you have an old bed frame and a welder around cut the frame up to a large box trap fram and use a large rat trap as the trip in the back of the trap and some sort of heavy metal (chain link or expanded metal) for a skin. make the gate so that the rat trap pulls the pen out of the gate(like a giatine) because your right theyre not scared of man kust like the rest of the animals that are hunting in areas you would never think they would be.


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## youngdon

Well today was the day! We got out before first light so that we were set and ready when legal time came. As the gray started to take hold from the black of night we knew we had made the right choice on where to set up. We could see them off in the distance about 400 yds to the west, a few were milling around sort of play fighting there were others that I could see through my scope laying off to one side. My rancher friend had initially told me that there were at least twenty dogs in this pack (I figured that was probably an exaggeration). I had dropped off the caller in what turned out to be less than an ideal spot and was wondering if I could get away with crawling over to it and moving it about thirty feet farther from us(I wanted to move it to a small ravine that I didn't know was there in the darkness). I decided to leave it and take our chances that things would work out as we had the wind and a little elevation working for us. I started the caller on pup distress on low volume and you could see their ears perk up immediatly, I boosted the volume then dropped it back a couple of times as I have found that it mimics a pup or distressed animal turning around or rolling in distress. Holy crap here they came I swear there were about twenty of them, I whispered HOLD IT ,Hold it Wait till they are on the caller.(it was up off the ground, so it didn't get shot,thanks for the reminder yotecatslayer) As they got about half way they slowed a bit as if they were leery of something but the lead dogs just held up to let the others begin to spread out. Thinking back it was rather well choreographed on their part,once they spread a bit they were hard charging again and were almost too fast to track across the desert floor. Deep breath Shoot now i said and we both started blasting as they came on to the caller the first shot of mine missed but it was ok as the next two connected as they began to flee. They didn't seem to flee as fast as they came in so we just kept shooting. Two dogs were DRT there were two more on their way out that we finished with my rugerMkII22/45. We watched where they went and followed on quads thinking that we could catch up and head them off. We never did see the pack again but did see one lone dog that we both agreed was in the pack so I shot him as well. We then went back to the original spot and picked up the dogs and threw them in bags as my friend said he would bury them using his backhoe. So we took five total. Next time I'll take my .243 again but also a shot gun as I think we could have done a little more damage on the initial volley, there would have been more clean up I'm sure, and I still do not want wounded animals suffering needlessly, but I believe that we could thin them quicker. the heaviest dog that we killed looked to be a bit on the hungry side and probably didn't weigh more that 35 lbs it was rather sad. That should end my post for today and I'll keep you posted on the rest of them.


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## chuck richards

That's great news. Feral dogs are the worst thing for local wildlife. Right up there with feral cats. Not to mention the farmers livestock. Good Job


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## youngdon

I hope to get out this next week a few times and do a little more damage to them. The rancher wants to put cattle back in there in late June or early July and would like for them to be gone by then.


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## chuck richards

You had mentioned legal shooting light. In Or the landowner or his "agent" can shoot predators 24 hours a day and with lights. Can you do this in AZ?? might be an idea since your dogs are a little educated now. A night shoot over bait may be just the ticket. This is only if it is legal in your state.


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## El Gato Loco

And a supressor on your rifle would make things interesting too. Can you imagine them looking around and wondering why their friends are falling over?


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## youngdon

We are sun up to sun down on all hunting in AZ except for raccoons although as these are not game animals I'm not sure what Game and Fish would allow, maybe I'll have to check into it. I am pretty sure that a suppressor would not be allowed although I would like to know as that sounds like a blast. Night vision, now that would be the ticket.


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## TexAgBQ81

Chris is on the right track as far as Texas is concerned anyway----- under Means and Methods on page 56 of this years manual --- Nongame Animals (non-protected) "any lawful firearm, pellet gun, or other air gun is legal"


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## El Gato Loco

TexAgBQ81 said:


> Chris is on the right track as far as Texas is concerned anyway----- under Means and Methods on page 56 of this years manual --- Nongame Animals (non-protected) "any lawful firearm, pellet gun, or other air gun is legal"


Yea, but a suppressor is not lawful unless properly registered and taxed and that is not a simple process. It's about the same process as obtaining the right to own a machine gun, SBR, or explosives. I am working on it though!


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## TexAgBQ81

May i suggest doing it thru a trust it is much easier and faster-----no pictures, no CLEO signoff, and no fingerprints.... no one knows except those you want to know and your neighbors will never hear it.


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## ebbs

TexAgBQ81 said:


> May i suggest doing it thru a trust it is much easier and faster-----no pictures, no CLEO signoff, and no fingerprints.... no one knows except those you want to know and your neighbors will never hear it.


What's the process of going through a "trust"? Is that sort of along the lines of buying it through a business and burying it in the paperwork?


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## wilded

I have a friend in Round Rock that is a Class III dealer and he tells me a trust is the way to go. It is not that difficult to do but the tax stamp is $200.00 plus the cost of whatever you are buying. Each one must have a seperate tax stamp if you obtain them for different calibers. I also found that the suppressor does not help that much unless you use sub-sonic speed ammo, which really cuts down on velocity, ballistics and knockdown power.


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## youngdon

Does anyone know the approximate cost of one? Just for the sake of conversation of course.


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## TexAgBQ81

Sorry i do not know the workings on how it might work along the business lines.
The trust will allow the persons listed in the trust to have possession of the suppressor. for example if you live in Texas and move to a state that does not allow them, anyone listed n your trust can "hold" your title II weapon (SBR--short barreled rifle, machine gun, or suppressor). a suppressor must have the appropriate ATF $200 tax stamp and a COPY must always accompany it at all times. the original needs to be kept in the safe or safety deposit box. i carry a copy of the trust in the vehicle also. the stamp is 1 page, front and back, the trust can be a lot of pages mine is about 24 pages. i my case for the stamp, i was able to use an old sling that had a cartridge carrier attached to it that i folded the COPY to fit then placed in a waterproof baggie and keep it in the sling and on the rifle at all times. i had mine done by a class III lawyer so i would know it was correct, but i have heard of several persons using legalzoom.
Wilded is correct on the subsoinc ammo----for the quietest operation you cannot use hi-velosity stuff, if you do use it, you can hear the crack of the bullet breaking the sound barrier but, it is more difficult to locate where the shot came from. also like Ed stated with subsonic ammo you loose knockdown power so you have to adjust your caliber larger and close your distance. i have a 300whisper which uses a 221 case (or cutdown 223 case)with a 220 or 240 grain 30 caliber bullet. moving below the speed of sound. hope this helps.


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## youngdon

Well I guess I'll have to get out this week and try these guys gain. I called my friend and I don't know if he'll make it or not but thats ok. I think I'll take the shot gun as well this time. I just need to get out and roam some.


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## ebbs

youngdon said:


> Well I guess I'll have to get out this week and try these guys gain. I called my friend and I don't know if he'll make it or not but thats ok. I think I'll take the shot gun as well this time. I just need to get out and roam some.


Count me in! I wonder how long of a drive it is to Goodyear from Greeley? I'm betting 16 hour minimum.


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## youngdon

It takes me about 13 to get from here to my daughters outside of Colorado Springs, I'm guessing another 1.5 for you. Honest I'd tell ya to come on but I had better ask the rancher first. I'm sure it would be OK but I don't want to step on any toes.


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## ebbs

I appreciate the hospitality, but for now I'm just jerking your chain. This time of year is swamped for me. Sounds like a blast though. Animals in packs interest me and freak me out a bit at the same time.


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## ReidRH

Here in Mississippi the Laws concerning Shooting a dog Sux, I can Tell You the People that made the Laws Have Never had a Feral Dog Problem! If You Shoot a Dog and Get Caught You will Pay the dog owner What Ever he Says the value of the Dog is and Could Possibly be fined a thousand Dollars and face up to a Year in Jail, I am gonna Go with the SSS Theory YD Better all the Way around for Everyone. That Being Said What could be more fun than Hunting something that has No fear of You and would attack you as fast as it would a rabbit!


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## ebbs

reidrh said:


> here in mississippi the laws concerning shooting a dog sux, i can tell you the people that made the laws have never had a feral dog problem! If you shoot a dog and get caught you will pay the dog owner what ever he says the value of the dog is and could possibly be fined a thousand dollars and face up to a year in jail, i am gonna go with the sss theory yd better all the way around for everyone. That being said what could be more fun than hunting something that has no fear of you and would attack you as fast as it would a rabbit!


sss!!!!!!!!!!


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