# Saami specifications---HELP!!



## Antlerz22 (Apr 18, 2011)

Ok, ran into a slight quandary at least as far as what seems logical to me. The maximum OAL for a .243 by Saami standards is 2.710. My daughters New England Firearms .243 measured with a hornady OAL gauge was 2.789 !! My Savage was 2.704 which is ok. If there is an industry standard for measurements such as Saami, then how can a manufacturer go beyond those standards? And lastly is this a problem/dangerous anomaly? Factory rounds (which I measured--2.672) by that measurement are "jumping" quite a bit before engagement. Is the difference by my measurements within the parameters of what is safe/functional given the jump of .117--what are your thoughts to those of you who reload not just occasionally/hobby-- but in depth. Also how would that be offset by me reloading at the max Saami for her rifle, or should I go further to within say .002 from the rifling?


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

SAAMI as you are refering to it is a cartridge length standard not a CHAMBER standard.There is also a SAAMI chamber standard...it is NOT an exact measurement as some chambers are looser than others. As an example of this is that you should never neck size a cartridge from one gun to shoot in another...it may not chamber. Nearly all rifles have a diferent amount of freebore ( a length of barrel at bore size dimension with (usually) no rifling.> This freebore is thought by some to help with bullet alignment. Changing the MAX OAL length of a cartridge will have an effect of pressure.

SAAMI specs are to insure that all ammunition will chamber and fire in ALL guns SAFELY.
I'm not quite sure why you want to start seating bullets beyond their recommended lengths,_ Find a COAL _and start there.

Neck sizing is done to a cartridge that is to be fired in the same rifle as the case has been expanded to match that rifles chamber.

As a further side note I consider myself a hobbist reloader, for further clarification on this matter you should contact a ballistics expert at one of the many bullet/powder manufacturers.


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## Antlerz22 (Apr 18, 2011)

youngdon said:


> SAAMI as you are refering to it is a cartridge length standard not a CHAMBER standard.There is also a SAAMI chamber standard...it is NOT an exact measurement as some chambers are looser than others. As an example of this is that you should never neck size a cartridge from one gun to shoot in another...it may not chamber. Nearly all rifles have a diferent amount of freebore ( a length of barrel at bore size dimension with (usually) no rifling.> This freebore is thought by some to help with bullet alignment. Changing the MAX OAL length of a cartridge will have an effect of pressure.
> 
> SAAMI specs are to insure that all ammunition will chamber and fire in ALL guns SAFELY.
> I'm not quite sure why you want to start seating bullets beyond their recommended lengths,_ Find a COAL _and start there.
> ...


 The c.o.a.l was what I posted for a factory round I measured. I havent seated any rounds yet as this was the reasoning behind my post. I knew there was an issue, just wasnt sure exactly what would be proper. IF I seat to the Sammi coal, which is stated as such and depicted with a drawing and numerical specs in my Nosler reloading manual. THEN I will have a .117 "jump" was all I was saying. It was posted as a confirmation of the Saami COAL and to point out my dilemma of wanting to get within .002 of the rifling which isnt possible if adhering to Saami. Lastly I have read in other forums where I also saw data indicating personal loads where COAL _*WAS*_ beyond the Saami specs. Im not saying its okay to do so or the like but more of query to see if anyone has done it, is it common/normal to do so--as does it happen all the time etc.., and or is it SAFE. Lastly, I did know it was cartridge OAL, but in my typing inadvertently omitted it, as I knew in my mind--but forgot clarification in type . It was just that my Savage allowed me to seat the bullet within .002 of the rifling _*AND *_stay under Saami CARTRIDGE overall length. And as such-if I loaded to max COAL with Saami specs (2.710 coal) on my daughters--it would have been quite a jump at .117 off the rifling. Thanks for bringing to light my oversight on mentioning/clarifying that important difference. And simply because you dont compete, shoot a ton or all the time, doesnt mean you are just a hobbyist--unless its not a passion . If its a passion whether you do it everyday or on occasion, makes the details of reloading close to; if not at the same level as professionals in my opinion. Or maybe I have tunnel vision (a.n.a.l) when it comes to things that really interest me. And yes I only neck size as well, which brings in another problem--seperating my daughters brass from mine which are all intermixed!! UGH. Im going to have to see if my calipers can smoke out the difference between the two. Going to measure at the neck where the shoulder starts, and go from there.


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

Mark hers with a sharpie.....Or red primer sealer....on the case head.I assume she won't be shooting as much as you...and tumble them apart from each other


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## knapper (Feb 5, 2010)

I shoot 223 that is too long to fit in an ar-15 mag due to the shape of the bullet. I must load each one in by the ejection port and I am not touching the rifling. This is loaded for match shooting only and is common for target shooters. The cases are neck sized only and for one rifle only. The bullet is an 80 gr. match king. So load and keep them seprate and there will be no problem.


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## CO204yoter (Aug 9, 2010)

i have a nef aswell in 204 and mine is long too but since it is a single shot you are able to laod longer and get more accuracy

for my yote loads i run mine 2.412 vrs factory of 2.259 and get amazing accuracy and since it is my only 204 i dont worry to much about it


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## 28LX (Jun 25, 2012)

I would just ignore the SAAMI COAL alltogether if you are measuring your chamber. I use the Hornady COAL tool to measure all the different bullets I shoot.. Work up new handloads with the bullet seated out to touch the rifleing if possible (pressure will be highest at this length) and alot of bullets shoot best kissing the rifleing. By starting with the bullet max length if you have to start seating your bullets deeper to find a COAL your rifle likes you will know the load is safe as pressure in a rifle drops with an increase in freebore.


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

I don't think I would "ignore" the SAAMI standards (it's there for a reason), rather I would use the recommended strategy of working up to a desired length. A light for caliber bullet(shorter) may have a suprising pressure spike that will be seen before a dangerous level is reached.


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## 28LX (Jun 25, 2012)

Youngdon,

It is my understanding that the SAAMI COAL standard is to insure that a cartridge will chamber in all rifles. If your loading ammo for your individual chamber and throat length start with a starting load with the bullet kissing the lands and work up from there. You will find the maximum load for your rifle faster with the bullet kissing the lands (it wont be the starting load) simply because the bullet is encountering resistance immediately. If you start with a shorter COAL work up a load then decide you want to try to seat the bullet farther out you may be asking for trouble and find that pressure spike you where talking about.Freebore allows pressure to drop before the bullet reaches the lands.I should clarify dont start with the bullet jammed into the lands just touching them.


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

By your method ( then decide you want to try to seat the bullet farther out you may be asking for trouble and find that pressure spike you where talking about.) you may start out at that spike. I've also found that the maximum load is rarely the most accurate load and that .008 to .010 off the lands is usually more accurate(providing your magazine will accept a cartridge of that length). I've worked many loads past SAAMI COAL through the years and find working out to be the safest way.
Keep in mind that many novice reloaders may be reading this thread.


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## 28LX (Jun 25, 2012)

Don,
I understand your concern for the new reloader. My method finds the high pressure load and allows you to reduce the load and work from there.I am not saying your method is wrong by any means but to clarify mine I will describe in more detail.

Step 1 Find the maximum length for your chosen bullet in relation to your chamber.
Step 2 Pick a given powder that per the reloading manual gives the velocity performance you desire.
Step 3 Load that combination starting with the starting load and work up in 1 grain increments loading 3 rounds in each increment to max..
Step 4 Shoot those loads and listen to your rifle it will tell you what it likes. Usually groups will tighten up as the charge increases then start to increase again. you will eventually reach your rifles Max wich will be evident by flat primers or your casehead flowing into the extractor or ejector slot.Now relax rifles are blown up by gross overcharges or useing the wrong burning rate powder you will not blow your rifle up working in 1 grain increments.
Step 5 You have found the max load for YOUR rifle with that given combination. Take the most accurate load below max and start seating the bullet deeper by .010 or .005 increments until you find the most accurate load.
Step 6 You have found both the Max and most accurate charge for a given bullet in your rifle and not wasted a box of bullets doing it.
COAL in loading manuals means nothing in respects to your rifle. Pressure is a directly related to chamber specs.Your chamber is not related to the test chamber that the data Nosler ,Speer ect used to make thier manual. Starting loads will be safe in all these manuals your max load will be different.


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

28LX,

I'll start low and work up thank you....I never start at the lowest listed load in a manual(usually the middle unless I have a pet load from another gun thatis below max.), nor do I pick a powder based on velocity.
We're basically doing the same thing(but in a near opposite direction, in regards to seating depth) but I start at the low pressure side of oal, while you choose to start at the high end(less free bore) .I have no need or want to find the high pressure load for any given cartridge just to find it, nor do I understand why you would want to find it for no other reason than to back away from it.
I see your method but, after 30 yrs I think I have a method that works for me.


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## knapper (Feb 5, 2010)

Don I think that is the way to do it. The only bullets that touch the lands of mine are cast and then I do it very little. I do use some loads that are over max. case lenght are my match 223 and only because they are made to be long and will not fit in the mags. I have worked with them and would not shot them in any other 223 I have due to the chamber being for that. Even then I will not touch the lands with the bullets, they are set back to keep the pressure ****** from happening. Each rifle I have has been started at lower powder charges and worked up with bullets seated close not touching the lands. Each bullet is checked to make sure that there are no bullets touching the lands.


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## Antlerz22 (Apr 18, 2011)

youngdon said:


> 28LX,
> 
> I'll start low and work up thank you....I never start at the lowest listed load in a manual(usually the middle unless I have a pet load from another gun thatis below max.), nor do I pick a powder based on velocity.
> We're basically doing the same thing(but in a near opposite direction, in regards to seating depth) but I start at the low pressure side of oal, while you choose to start at the high end(less free bore) .I have no need or want to find the high pressure load for any given cartridge just to find it, nor do I understand why you would want to find it for no other reason than to back away from it.
> I see your method but, after 30 yrs I think I have a method that works for me.


 Ok I find the chamber coal with a hornady coal tool as well and seat bullets 1.5 thousandths off the lands and then start low with the powder and go up till either i get the best grouping or pressure signs indicate the limit. I never try to have the bullet contact the rifling as there are problems with closing the bolt fully (for me) and also there will invariably be variations in coal while reloading. I have that problem on occasion and I now check every round for consistency within 1 thousandth variation +/- of that 1.5 thousandths from the lands "base" setting.


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## knapper (Feb 5, 2010)

Weatherby's were able to get there higher velocitys by rounding the sholders and setting the bullet farther back from the rifling to get the speed up.


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## 28LX (Jun 25, 2012)

Antlerz22 said:


> Ok I find the chamber coal with a hornady coal tool as well and seat bullets 1.5 thousandths off the lands and then start low with the powder and go up till either i get the best grouping or pressure signs indicate the limit. I never try to have the bullet contact the rifling as there are problems with closing the bolt fully (for me) and also there will invariably be variations in coal while reloading. I have that problem on occasion and I now check every round for consistency within 1 thousandth variation +/- of that 1.5 thousandths from the lands "base" setting.


Antlerz,
Since you have the Hornady OAL tool I assume you are measuring cartridge length off the bullet ogive with only one thousandth of an inch variation you must be.If you are having problems closing the bolt it sounds like you are slightly jamming the bullet in the lands.Kissing the lands is just my preferred method as a base but it is not always possible.If I cant reach them I use my maximum magazine length as a base.Many different ways to reload and plenty of good advice given in this thread.I like to try to make the most accurate loads possible and meet factory round velocity numbers thats my personal standards.The pressure gremlin is always there I just prefer to find it at the start then stay away from it from there.


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## 28LX (Jun 25, 2012)

knapper said:


> Weatherby's were able to get there higher velocitys by rounding the sholders and setting the bullet farther back from the rifling to get the speed up.


Yep Weatherby cut his chambers with alot of freebore and added more powder.


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## 28LX (Jun 25, 2012)

knapper said:


> Don I think that is the way to do it. The only bullets that touch the lands of mine are cast and then I do it very little. I do use some loads that are over max. case lenght are my match 223 and only because they are made to be long and will not fit in the mags. I have worked with them and would not shot them in any other 223 I have due to the chamber being for that. Even then I will not touch the lands with the bullets, they are set back to keep the pressure ****** from happening. Each rifle I have has been started at lower powder charges and worked up with bullets seated close not touching the lands. Each bullet is checked to make sure that there are no bullets touching the lands.


Knapper,
A bullet touching the lands does not cause erratic pressure spikes. The pressure will be just as consistant as a bullet seated off the lands.If you worked up to a max load with the bullet seated off the lands then load some up with the bullet closer or touching the lands pressure will go up but its not an unexsplained spike.


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## Antlerz22 (Apr 18, 2011)

28LX said:


> Antlerz,
> Since you have the Hornady OAL tool I assume you are measuring cartridge length off the bullet ogive with only one thousandth of an inch variation you must be.If you are having problems closing the bolt it sounds like you are slightly jamming the bullet in the lands.Kissing the lands is just my preferred method as a base but it is not always possible.If I cant reach them I use my maximum magazine length as a base.Many different ways to reload and plenty of good advice given in this thread.I like to try to make the most accurate loads possible and meet factory round velocity numbers thats my personal standards.The pressure gremlin is always there I just prefer to find it at the start then stay away from it from there.


 I dont have the device which lets me do the ogive measurement, I'm just doing it the conventional way and barely feeling the bullet touch and locking it down then measuring--I do this like 3 times and check all the measurements to make sure I did it right the first time. I wonder how an ogive measurement can be any more accurate vs when the bullet just touches the lands. When the bullet touches the lands that is an exact length considering shape of the bullet/ogive and all that entails. Touching is touching and the only benefit of that device would be to know exactly WHERE the rifling was making first contact IMO--either way the result is the same. One you know where, by set manufacturing dimensions in a device (ogive thingy) then measuring, the other by feeling the contact and measuring. If I'm off on this, please explain EXACTLY in detail (I gots to know lol) how the device works--and I'll go from there on whether to get one or not.


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## 28LX (Jun 25, 2012)

If your measuring your loaded rounds OAL by the bullet tip your gonna see swings in length.The bullets ogive is a much more consistant point to measure from.It sounds like your using the bullets ogive to find the seating depth then measuring your loaded rounds off the bullet tip to check loaded length.Even the best bullets have a varience in tip length your rounds are probably much more precise than you think.


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## 28LX (Jun 25, 2012)

Antlerz,

Just for the heck of it I grabbed 2 kinds of 22 cal bullets and measured 5 each base to tip and base to ogive.

Nosler 50 gr BT

Base to Tip .786,.786,.788,.786.5,.788 
Base to Ogive ..388,.388,.388,.388,..387.5

Nosler 69gr Custom Competition

Base to Tip .899,.897,.901,.902,.896
Base to Ogive .528,.528,.528,.529,.528


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## Antlerz22 (Apr 18, 2011)

28LX said:


> If your measuring your loaded rounds OAL by the bullet tip your gonna see swings in length.The bullets ogive is a much more consistant point to measure from.It sounds like your using the bullets ogive to find the seating depth then measuring your loaded rounds off the bullet tip to check loaded length.Even the best bullets have a varience in tip length your rounds are probably much more precise than you think.


 Ok I'm picking up what youre laying down, 2 thousandths if you look at it in your dial calipers is very small indeed and I could see manufacturing variations in a piece of plastic showing up as a difference in length--but actually where the measurement came from (ultimately where with the Hornady oal gauge gets its reading) is the ogive where it makes contact. BUT it still leaves me wondering why some bolt in fine and others are hard!!---IF the rounds are as accurately seated as I had hoped they were. So now I'm going to back off the lands from a contact at 2.705 to a seated depth of 2.7025--that will/should give the small coal variances that are causing me problems room to disappear.


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## Antlerz22 (Apr 18, 2011)

28LX said:


> Antlerz,
> 
> Just for the heck of it I grabbed 2 kinds of 22 cal bullets and measured 5 each base to tip and base to ogive.
> 
> ...


 Ok that explains a lot to me now seeing the numbers. Thanks for being as anal as I normally am--but I didnt have the tool to go the nth degree as you did. It WILL be a part of my seating proceedure as soon as I can get one. Im wanting to split hairs and this is the only path that way as far as I'm concerned. Thanks a ton!! So basically disregard the post before this one as I had answered it before reading this one LOL. But my only choice at this point is to back off a hair more OR go old school and smoke my rounds with carbide once again!! rifling marks dont lie!! And I can measure to the rifling marks on the ogive from the base--which could be tricky to do--but I also want to get a micro adjustable seater die as well. That way I have a reference base to work from once I get the ogive measurement with the ogive tool I need. Sigh---more money LOL.


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## Antlerz22 (Apr 18, 2011)

Okay been dwelling all afternoon on my variation problem. Figured it out!! Since the tips are invariably the culprit for example-- 2 thousandths is "invisible" to the eye as far as looking at a bullet. When I made my corrections--I actually was making the "short" coal bullets--LONGER than my setting of 2.7035 which was 1.5 thousandths shorter than my max coal on the lands. ALL because it was seated right from the get-go (from the ogive--which was what the gauge was giving me)!! the variation showing wasnt bullet seating depth varying--it was the tip length difference and I was adding distance on my short rounds---which werent short in the first place. So now im going to measure the bullet-, then my case--add the two and subtract what I need to get 2.7035--then mark that first bullets seating depth on the side of it, seat it and then measure to confirm exactness. Whew that was a mouthful--but I feel 100% on this analogy finally. As the old saying sometimes goes, better to leave well enough alone! But at least it was a learning process, and thats not always a bad thing either--as I wont forget it! Also Im going to mark and leave one bullet made exactly for each grain I'll be shooting, to reset the die when I change grains. Just set it in the press run the ram up all the way and (seater up all the way at this point) and then screw the seater in till it contacts on the bullet grain I'm going to load.


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## 28LX (Jun 25, 2012)

Antlerz,

I honestly dont think .001 difference in seating depth would even be noticeable in a bolt action. Just the leverage and camming action a bolt action has by desighn should make this small difference unnoticable.Personaly I think it may be your brass.Are you full length sizeing everytime or neck sizeing?


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## 28LX (Jun 25, 2012)

Antlerz,

We posted at the same time. I figured you would find your ammo was much more precise than you originally thought.


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## 28LX (Jun 25, 2012)

28LX said:


> Antlerz,
> 
> We posted at the same time. I figured you would find your ammo was much more precise than you originally thought.


Although by adjusting for your (short) rounds you may have been moving the bullets ogive many thousandths instead of one that would exsplain your stiff bolt.Problem may be solved all the way around.


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## Antlerz22 (Apr 18, 2011)

28LX said:


> Antlerz,
> 
> I honestly dont think .001 difference in seating depth would even be noticeable in a bolt action. Just the leverage and camming action a bolt action has by desighn should make this small difference unnoticable.Personaly I think it may be your brass.Are you full length sizeing everytime or neck sizeing?


 I have neck size dies only


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## 28LX (Jun 25, 2012)

I would bet thats your problem with the stiff bolt on some rounds.Brass although usually very uniform still can grow at different rates and hotter loads loads stress it more.It sounds like you are experiencing a slight crush fit when you chamber some rounds.Its an easy fix bump the shoulders back some.


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

+1 on bumping the shoulder back 22.


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## Antlerz22 (Apr 18, 2011)

28LX said:


> +1 on bumping the shoulder back 22.


 Ok sounds like a unanimous remedy--clue me in guys...


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## 28LX (Jun 25, 2012)

Brass flows forward as it is stressed in firing.Your brass exspands to seal your chamber than springs back when pressure drops.After a few firings brass gets harder from being worked and slightly thicker in the neck shoulder area so it doesnt spring back as much.Now when you chamber a round the case is getting too long for the chamber and the shoulder is rubbing on the chamber walls commonly called a crush fit this usually will leave a shiney ring on your primer as well from being pushed up against the bolt face.A slight crush fit can be good for accuracy because it helps center the cartridge in the chamber but to much is a pain in the a**.I prefer to just resize my case enough to chamber easily but you have to use a full length size die or body die to do it.A good method is to raise the ram on your press and screw in a full length size die until it contacts the shell holder.Now back your size die out 2 to 3 full turns.Lube and size a case and try to chamber it it will probably not feel any different at this point.Now turn your die a quarter turn and repeat eventually your gonna reach a point where the case wont chamber at all now your full length die is screwed down far enough its starting to squeeze the sides of the case but its not contacting the shoulder yet making your case even longer.Your getting close now so reduce your turns in on the die to 1/8. Keep repeating until your case just chambers easily or with very slight resistance once you find that spot lock the die down and leave it alone.


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

You'll definitly need a full length set of dies Never buy just the neck dies. I hope you got the set screw lock rings we talked about, those lee O-ring dies don't hold tight enough.


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## knapper (Feb 5, 2010)

I have some that are harder to chamber than others and I put it to head space on the shoulder and not bullet seating depth because I don't seat the bullets that close.


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## Antlerz22 (Apr 18, 2011)

28LX said:


> Brass flows forward as it is stressed in firing.Your brass exspands to seal your chamber than springs back when pressure drops.After a few firings brass gets harder from being worked and slightly thicker in the neck shoulder area so it doesnt spring back as much.Now when you chamber a round the case is getting too long for the chamber and the shoulder is rubbing on the chamber walls commonly called a crush fit this usually will leave a shiney ring on your primer as well from being pushed up against the bolt face.A slight crush fit can be good for accuracy because it helps center the cartridge in the chamber but to much is a pain in the a**.I prefer to just resize my case enough to chamber easily but you have to use a full length size die or body die to do it.A good method is to raise the ram on your press and screw in a full length size die until it contacts the shell holder.Now back your size die out 2 to 3 full turns.Lube and size a case and try to chamber it it will probably not feel any different at this point.Now turn your die a quarter turn and repeat eventually your gonna reach a point where the case wont chamber at all now your full length die is screwed down far enough its starting to squeeze the sides of the case but its not contacting the shoulder yet making your case even longer.Your getting close now so reduce your turns in on the die to 1/8. Keep repeating until your case just chambers easily or with very slight resistance once you find that spot lock the die down and leave it alone.


 That seems to defeat the whole purpose of neck sizing. If my case has expanded to my chamber dimensions from firing then it seems impossible for it to on the OUTSIDE of the case in ALL areas except where I resize--the neck--to lengthen. So all the brass flow is/can only occur on the INSIDE. This is simple logic, at least for me. Also I inside neck ream and havent yet (only had 2 reloads on these cases) extracted any excess brass from within the neck. Which would also indicate there hasnt been any case dimension altering in and of itself up to this point. Im thinking it it simply those rounds I measured short--which werent--and I backed off my seater die and lengthened those particular "short" rounds by pulling them and reseating at a longer coal. That then translated into the round hitting fairly hard on the lands. So bear with me, I understand what you are saying but in having my cases fire formed to my chamber dimensions the case no longer has the option to grow EXCEPT in neck length--which I trim, and brass flow on the inside of the neck. So the mentioned coal problems seem the only alternatives as a reason for my hard chambering rounds.


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## 28LX (Jun 25, 2012)

Antlerz 
Experience is the best teacher so keep just neck sizeing and you will find your logic is flawed.


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## knapper (Feb 5, 2010)

If you back of the neck sizer then you will have only less neck to hold the bullet in a shell. I have fired some cases that were hard to close the bolt on and after could be chambered with ease, thus you nave moved the shoulder a small amount back with that firing. The difference being that it may have had higher pressure applied to the shoulder and it move to the point of where the chamber is just the perfect fit, then neck size. Inside neck trimming only needs to be done more with new brass and cases that have been necked down. I have three rifles that shoot 260 Rem. and the chambers are close enough to each other that I do not need to shoot only one for each rifle I simply grab one and shoot it. They all are over all length sized and I do not trim the cases for length. A test to see if your neck brass is too tight is to slip a bullet in the neck, it should slide in with little or no effort. Each new rifle I get is fired and the fired cases are smoked to see where the neck is on the shoulder of the case. Most chambers are set to min. chambers and the die needs to be set for that rifle. I had a friend once that was complaining about case head seperations after two loadings and when we set the die to the case he got many more loadings with that brass. He had followed the instructions of the manufacture and that rifle was set with a long head space.


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## DeereGuy (Feb 1, 2012)

This is a very timely post for me...to the OP...thanks for asking. I have a Dilion 650 and have loaded over 15,000 rounds if pistol bullets with it....Rifle reloading seems a lot more involved. I just picked up the conversion kit and dilion dies for it yesterday. All the once fired brass I have has been through my savage. 223 but I do have 100 new cases of Winchester brass. This thread has been very helpful for me....thanks to all of you that have given advise on this.

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

"So the mentioned coal problems seem the only alternatives as a reason for my hard chambering rounds."

So are you saying the bullet being rammed into the rifling is the problem ?

If it is, what you are saying, then try just chambering your unloaded and sized brass..I bet you'll still have a problem closing the bolt.....


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## Antlerz22 (Apr 18, 2011)

youngdon said:


> "So the mentioned coal problems seem the only alternatives as a reason for my hard chambering rounds."
> 
> So are you saying the bullet being rammed into the rifling is the problem ?
> 
> If it is, what you are saying, then try just chambering your unloaded and sized brass..I bet you'll still have a problem closing the bolt.....


 Thats a good idea Don, will do that later tonight and have the results late tonight or early tomorrow.


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