# ***Winchester Varmint HE 17WSM Bullets***



## dwtrees (Mar 5, 2012)

Ladies and Gentlemen,

I strongly urge you to weigh each and every bullet for your 17WSM. On the advise from another post, I weighed the bullets in one box and found 49 of them weighed between 67.4 grains up to 68 grains.

ONE OF THEM WEIGHED 42.3 GRAINS an full 25 grains lighter than the rest of them. When you subtract the 25 grain bullet, that only leaves 17 grains which is probably what the case weighs. I don't think there is any powder in that bullet.

I have sent a report to Winchester also.


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## hassell (Feb 9, 2010)

Good post.


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## prairiewolf (Feb 19, 2012)

I am anxious to hear what they say, thanks for posting. Just this past weekend a friend had a Winchester soft point .223 not fire.


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## glenway (Mar 27, 2011)

That's why I suggested weighing them, DW. You might want to pull the bullets on a few of the wider-range samples and weigh the powder charges. I can't think of what else may cause the difference but it would be good to know. It will be interesting to see how Winchester responds.


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## glenway (Mar 27, 2011)

On second thought, *forget pulling any bullets with a kinetic type puller in this cartridge*, because slamming the primer could result in discharge, if the puller holds the cartridge by the rim.

I weighed 50 cartridges of the 25 grain loads and came up with the following. *Total Weight/Number in Box*

67.2/6 - 67.3/10 - 67.4/13 - 67.5/12 - 67.6/6 - 67.7/3

With a Sharpie, I put the weights on each one and when weather allows the chronograph to work, I'll find out the differences in velocity comparing lightest to heaviest. I realize variations in bullet weight and case weight are factors, so I'll weigh the cases after shooting. For now, bullets will have to be the "X" factor.

Also noted is how most of the cartridges weighed in the middle range. But, a half grain variation - assuming it's powder - would be a lot percentage wise. It could certainly point to mysterious flyers.


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## 220swift (Mar 2, 2011)

Good info Glen, Thanks !


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## OHIOOutdoors2 (May 1, 2013)

I say they should award you for your time with a free box or two.


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## SWAMPBUCK10PT (Apr 5, 2010)

*AFTER READING THIS POST I *

*HAD TO GO WEIGHT 10 ROUNDS OF THE 25GR ROUNDS BECAUSE I'VE HAD A FEW MISS FIRES---ONE OF WHICH I FIRED FOR TIMES TURNING EACH TIME IT HAS FOUR GOOD DENTS IN THE RIM BUT DIDN'T FIRE*

*1-67.1*

*2-67.5*

*3-67.3*

*4-67.7*

*5-67.3*

*6-67.4*

*7-67.4*

*8-67.5*

*9-67.4*

*10-67.5------THE MISS FIRE WEIGHT 68.2--MUST BE FULL OF POWDER BUT THE RIM MUST BE EMPTY----SHOULD SEND IT TO WINCHESTER--ITS NOT THE FIRST THAT DIDN'T FIRE BUT WHEN I ROTATED THE OTHERS THEY WENT OFF---BE INTERESTED IN WHAT WINCHESTER HAS TO SAY-----SB*


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## JTKillough (May 4, 2010)

Not good. Keep us posted. Very serious situation. Problem is, that an empty case has enough power in the primer to send a bullet into the bore of your rifle, then, if you don't notice, the next trigger squeeze sends another bullet and boom, bye bye rifle.


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## glenway (Mar 27, 2011)

I am going to be weighing all of them from now on. Not a bad thing to do with any rimfire ammo. The run-of-the-mill production rimfire ammo is never good enough for anything serious anyway and I'm beginning to understand why that is.

And, good point, JT. With low recoiling rimfires, one cannot assume he has missed a target, or that he may have put two rounds in the same hole, if he doesn't see a new hole in the target Instead, it would be smart to check the bore before squeezing the next one off whenever there is a question.


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## 22magnum (Feb 10, 2013)

Same goes for airgunners weigh your pellets for better accuracy.

Sent from my SGH-T889 using Tapatalk


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## glenway (Mar 27, 2011)

A bit more on weighing ammo (rimfire) that you cannot assemble yourself...

Weighing another box of .17 WSM 25-grain Winchester loads looks like this (*Total Weight/Number in Box)*

67.0/1 - 67.1/1 - 67.2/8 - 67.3/8 - 67.4/13 - 67.5/12 - 67.6/4 - 67.7/3

Again, no crazy spreads like others have had but still plenty of room for improving consistency. And, that gave me the idea to weigh some 350 rounds (250 remaining) and segregate the cartridges by weight. Since most of the weights are in the middle range, I should end up with a fair share of consistent weights.

While at it, I decided to weigh some of my favorite .22 LR ammo, which works well in any gun I've shot using it: Lapua Center X. Now, this isn't Lapua's finest like the Olympians use at $28/box but it's about half that and will not give a shooter an excuse to miss.

When I weighed the first 5 samples from a line in the box, they all weighed the same: 52.8 grains. Then I weighed random samples in the box with the same results, other than one round which weighed 52.75 grains.

Then I weighed some run of the mill Winchester Super X .22 LR and with only 7 rounds weighed, I got 6 different weights from 52.1 to 53.0 grains and stopped the exercise.

This is just a snapshot of the effects of quality control or the lack thereof. And, if you ever want to be a little better than the next guy, you now have a good place to start.


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

This is all pretty scary considering the possible damage that could occur to the shooter, and by-standers as well as the rifle. I guess I'll wait before looking at one.


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## dwtrees (Mar 5, 2012)

Well I haven't heard back from Winchester yet but I don't expect a rapid response from them any way.

My results from the 1st box are as follows;

16 @ 67.8 - 10 @ 67.7 - 10 @ 67.6 - 8 @ 67.5 - 5 @ 67.4 and then the 1 @ 42.3

The next box I weighed there were 26 @ 67.8 - 4 @ 67.9 and the rest were between 67.7 and 67.4 with 1 @ 62.4.

I put all the bullets that were 67.7 to 67.9 in the box I am going to use for hunting yotes and the rest in the box for plinking.

As soon as I hear anything from Winchester, I will let everyone know.


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## glenway (Mar 27, 2011)

DW, just to double check. Are you sure you had one at 42.3 grains? Assuming there was a bullet seated in a case, it doesn't make sense, because there couldn't be 25 grains of powder missing. I believe the powder weight is less than 10 grains.


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## dwtrees (Mar 5, 2012)

After reading your post I went to the gun room and re-zeroed my scale. I had the bullet sitting on the bench and reweighed it. It is actually 42.6 grains.






​​
Then I got out one of the bullets from the box and weighed it without moving the scale and it was 67.7 grains. I set that one on the bench and now I know why the other one was so light.






​​Its a 17 HMR in the same box as the WSM​
Boy do I feel dumb now for not comparing them earlier.


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## glenway (Mar 27, 2011)

Are you kidding me? How did it get in there? And, by the way, DW, a bullet is not a cartridge and sometimes we can confuse issues with such a slip. Much like cement is a component of concrete. Thanks for following up with us.


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## JTKillough (May 4, 2010)

Good thing you didn't try to shoot that HMR in the WSM. Jeez, that may go south quickly. You should give me that WSM so you don't hurt yourself, bye golly. Why chance it? Thats what brothers are for. Glad you figured that out. But, due to my New Years resolution, I can't tell you what that outta work quality control guy at Winchester has to say about that last thread.....Uff da!


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## dwtrees (Mar 5, 2012)

I finally got a response from Winchester. Received a phone call last Thursday and the rep left a message for me to call them back. After playing telephone tag for a couple of days we finally connected. Winchester wants the box of cartridges back for their quality control people to look at. The rep said they will send me a check for some new ammo, asked them if they are behind on production as I can not find any ammo around here to buy. The rep said they are making it as fast as they can and people are buying it as fast as they make it. Any way the UPS man dropped off a prepaid label to send the box of ammo back so I put the box (2/3rds full with the 17HMR in it) in another box to send it back to them. Will wait for the check to show up in the mail. At least I know they do respond to the emails we send them.


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## fr3db3ar (Aug 6, 2011)

That's a good thing. On a side note my Walmart got some in and I bought 5 boxes.

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## Guest (Mar 4, 2014)

I was talking to a guy at Cabelas about a week ago. He said that this is a known problem. He has had alot of people wanting to return this same ammo...but unfortunately he needs to send them to Winchester for the refund.

On a side note....He also told me that they have had a rediculous amount of problems with Hornady on major fluctuations in weight, powder charge and seat depth.. I had this happen with a box of leverevolution 30-30. Evidently Hornady has lost all value of quality control. Hence why I don't shoot Hornady.


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## dwtrees (Mar 5, 2012)

Update on the Ammo returned to Winchester. I have not heard anything from them on the box of ammo I returned but I did get a check in the mail from them for $40.00. Not bad considering I only paid $17.95 plus tax for the box.

Hopefully the quality control will improve some as I think this rifle could be a great one if the ammo was consistent.

If I hear anything else, I will let everyone know about it.


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## SWAMPBUCK10PT (Apr 5, 2010)

*Just picked up 3 boxes of 25gr from Marquette Walmart today---only let me buy 3 at 14.77 ea. I now have 10 boxes stored :look: ----I've had good accuracy out of my t/c custom barrel from MGM---HAVE HAD A FEW MISS FIRES--Ordered a new hammer spring from Belm to see if thats the problem---with the hammer spur on it might need a new spring----now all i need to do is put it on----------she sure kills the RED SQUIRRELS Super dead--dwt thanks for the up-date-----sb*


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

It's good to hear you got some money out of them, although I don't suspect you'll get an explanation of any kind due to legal mumbo jumbo. If they said there was a problem and someone was injured (or even scared) it would likely come back to bite them to the tune of a lot more money.


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## fr3db3ar (Aug 6, 2011)

Well at least you got an extra box. I just picked up. 4 boxes the other day at cabelas. I'm not hoarding, I'm stock piling.

Sent from my somewhere in the space time continuum.


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## youngdon (Mar 10, 2010)

Or being smart as I call it !


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## dwtrees (Mar 5, 2012)

I just wish I could find some ammo for it around here.


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## fr3db3ar (Aug 6, 2011)

Do you need some?

Sent from my somewhere in the space time continuum.


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## SWAMPBUCK10PT (Apr 5, 2010)

*If there's any left could go and buy some for ya and send them to ya---they were 14.77 a box------------------------------sb*


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## azpredatorhunter (Jul 24, 2012)

I just read this thread because I have nothing better to do right now... how about someone changing the title so the other members here will read it... ie: Warning! or Achtung! Just an idea.


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## dwtrees (Mar 5, 2012)

If you guy would sell me some ammo, I would definitely buy it from you. PM me


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## SWAMPBUCK10PT (Apr 5, 2010)

*DWT I'LL BE IN TOWN TOMORROW AND ON THE WAY HOME FROM CHURCH I'LLSTOP AT WALLMART --i'LL GET YOU A COUPLE OF BOXS IF THEY HAVE ANY LEFT AND GET THEM TO YA---SB*


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## dwtrees (Mar 5, 2012)

That would be great. Thanks for looking for me as I checked in town today at 8 places and no one has them around here yet.


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## fr3db3ar (Aug 6, 2011)

If skip doesn't find any, I can help but mine wee $18 a box from GM.

Sent from my somewhere in the space time continuum.


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## SWAMPBUCK10PT (Apr 5, 2010)

*dwt----I COULD ONLY GET ONE BOX AT WALMART THATS ALL THEY HAD LEFT 25 GR--SENDING PM----SB*


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## fr3db3ar (Aug 6, 2011)

I found a place today that had them for $20 and change. I didn't buy any.


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## knapper (Feb 5, 2010)

Up here you buy it when you see it or you may not get any at all, that applyes to more than ammo.


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## azpredatorhunter (Jul 24, 2012)

We have some at Dicks SG's, I think it was $19.00 a box of 50. I wonder if it's legal to send ammo? ie: to Knapper in Alaska...


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## fr3db3ar (Aug 6, 2011)

Sure, why wouldn't it be? It's still the US.

Sent from my somewhere in the space time continuum.


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## dwtrees (Mar 5, 2012)

You can send them UPS but not by mail. I sent the ammo back to Winchester by UPS.


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